JOEL ROSS: THE GOSPEL OF FRIENDS AND FAITH THROUGH MUSIC.

“Preach the gospel always-

Use words if necessary”

St. Francis of Assisi

 

NO ONE LIKES BEING PREACHED AT, ESPECIALLY IN A MUSIC VENUE

BUT WE ALL LOVE A GOOD MESSAGE AND A GOOD STORY.

JAMISON ROSS HAS USED HIS MUSIC TO CONVEY HIS MESSAGE OF BIBLICAL HOPE WITHOUT POUNDING A PULPIT. HIS LATEST ALBUMS CONVEY ETERNAL THEMES THAT TOUCH THE HEART AND SOUL, AND WHILE HIS PLAYING STAYS WITHIN THE JAZZ CANON, HIS THEMES ARE FROM THE BIBLICAL ONE

I FIRST SAW ROSS LEADING A TEAM WITH HIS LONG TERM FRIEND, ALTO SAXIST IMMANUEL WILKINS. THE CONCERT WAS A RAPHAELESQUE TAPESTRY OF SONGS WOVEN TOGETHER, SEAMLESSLY WITHOUT A STICH BEING DROPPED. THE EFFECT WAS ALMOST TELEPATHIC IN DELIVERY. I WALKED AWAY THAT NIGHT THINKING ABOUT WHAT IT TOOK FOR A BAND TO BE THAT COHESIVE.

WITH A NEW BAND, ROSS CONTINUES TO BE A VOICE IN THE WILDERNESS, AND RECENTLY HE WAS KIND ENOUGH TO SHARE HIS THOUGHTS ON HIS MUSIC, HIS FAITH AND HIS FRIENDSHIP. AS WITH HIS MUSIC, THE CHAT WAS A BALM IN GILEAD.

YOU HAD A GIG AT SMOKE IN NYC WITH YOUR GOOD VIBES BAND. YOU’VE HAD BASSIST  KANOA MENDENHALL AND DRUMMER JEREMY DUTTON ON YOUR BAND FOR YEARS. WHAT’S THE ADVANTAGE OF SO LONG AN ASSOCIATION, AND HOW LONG DID IT TAKE BEFORE YOU FELT THAT THEY ACTUALLY WERE A SIMPATICO TEAM?

The advantage is the synergy, and the unspoken possibilities.

I’ve known them since we were all in high school, so just being friends that long already sets a precedent. We’re on the same page as people, first. Then, having spent so much time playing music together, we’re now all speaking the same language

There are now certain aspects of things in music making that we don’t need to necessarily talk about; we can try new things because we are all so used to the way that we all speak this musical language.

BECAUSE YOUR MUSIC HAS SUCH A CHRISTIAN MESSAGE, ARE YOUR BAND MATES ON THE SAME PAGE AS YOU, OR DO THEY THINK, “WELL, THAT’S JUST JOEL SO WE’LL HAND IN THERE WITH IT”?

I’ve never explicitly tried to pry, or to get them to see things the way that I do, or believe what I believe, **but what I have talked about is that for my faith, the best type of living comes from a self-sacrificial type of living where you’re putting another person ahead of yourself

I do communicate that, if not to the band explicitly, when I’m talking to other people about how we operate. If we can make sure that the other person sounds the best that they can, if we do whatever we can do musically to help them sound good, then the whole thing will sound good.

I have talked about those parallels, and I think that they understand and embody that.

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“I do communicate that, if not to the band explicitly, when I’m talking to other people about how we operate. If we can make sure that the other person sounds the best that they can, if we do whatever we can do musically to help them sound good, then the whole thing will sound good”

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I ASK YOU THIS BECAUSE MANY PEOPLE YOUR AGE ARE NOT COMMITED TO ANYTHING. THE HAVE, AS I SAY “HAVE THEIR FEET FIRMLY PLANTED IN MID-AIR”. SO WHEN YOUR PEERS SEE SOMEONE HOLDING FAST TO A CAUSE, ARE THEY INTRIGUED, INTIMIDATED OR DO THEY JUST SLUFF IT OFF WITH “WELL, THAT’S JUST YOUR TRUTH”?

I think that there is intrigue. “Who is this, and what is it about?”

But the response does change from person to  person.

I just believe that,  when you stand for something, have a good foundation for it, and present it clearly and strongly it is, I don’t know if “unavoidable” is the right word.

It’s like the way we play our music; if we have clarity in what we’re trying to present, even if somebody doesn’t like it or agree with it, it’s still undeniable.

You can form your opinion about it, but you can’t deny that you are experiencing and hearing what it is

THIS NEW BAND HAS DEVEN DANIELS REPLACING YOUR LONG TERM ALTO SAXIST IMMANUEL WILKINS. HOW HARD WAS IT TO LET HIM GO, AND HOW DIFFICULT WAS IT TO FIND A REPLACEMENT?

It was incredibly difficult to let Immanuel go. Immanuel was more than just a good musician to replace; I’m a twin! I have never been so close to another human being on a personal and musical level besides my brother until I met Immanuel.

That being said, when I met Immanuel, heard him and got to know and love him, I knew that him being a part of my band would not last long. I just  knew his fame was rising. But not to say that he would never play with us again, but he had his own ensemble and was getting busy with  it

The funny thing is, that before he left the band, he told me “If I can’t play or do gigs anymore, call Devin Daniels

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“It’s like the way we play our music; if we have clarity in what we’re trying to present, even if somebody doesn’t like it or agree with it, it’s still undeniable”

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HOW DID YOU MEET DEVIN?
I met him over ten years ago in California when I first went to college at the Brubeck Institute.

He was already great; we just hadn’t had any opportunities to play together.

HOW LONG DOES IT TAKE FOR A NEW GUY TO BREAK AND AN BE PART OF A TEAM AND NOT JUST A BAND MEMBER?

(chuckles) It takes awhile

It’s like learning a different type of a dialect. You  may know the language, but you are learning colloquialisms

Devin is such a gifted musician that it’s not taking long

 

, but there are unspoken things that are between, like, me, Jeremy and Kenoa that are the things that he is learning. There’s a bit of a learning curve, even with me changing how I’m leading the band

Some things I don’t change, so that he understands from experience, but other things it will be like, “so when we do this, this is what it means”

I’m really pushing to have non-verbal communication be the main way that we navigate as an ensemble.I believe that everything we try to do musically can be done without having to verbally talk about it for the most part.

So, it’s a matter of learning some of those idiosyncracies.

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“I’m really pushing to have non-verbal communication be the main way that we navigate as an ensemble.I believe that everything we try to do musically can be done without having to verbally talk about it for the most part”

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WHEN YOU MEAN “NON-VERBAL”, DO YOU MEAN MUSICALLY, OR WITH GESTURES?

We never  make set lists. I never make a setlist

I generally will start playing a song, a melody, and we’ll go from there. Say we’re playing a song and are getting ready to end it, I or anyone has the ability to, but I will most likely already be thinking  about where we can go based on where we are, either from a rhythmic point of view, a harmonic point of view, or a key center.

Instead of telling people where’ we’re going to go, I’ll probably start phasing into the next place that we’re going, which we’ve been trying to explore more recently on our albums. Just playing one thing ***while still playing the previous piece and try to phase them together, so that getting from one thing to the next becomes a journey

We do that pretty heavily and pretty often

So, for Devin, I think it challenges him because we have a lot of music at our fingertips, so, for him it’s like “OK, what song are they going to?” (chuckles)

Once he knows where we are, then he’s cool.

DO YOU GUYS EVER DEPROGRAM YOURSELVES AFTER GIGS TO GO OVER HOW THE COMMUNICATION WENT?

Sometimes.

We were just in a sound check in Chicago the other week, and were working out. We were playing a song, and one of the unspoken rules in the band is that there’s a difference between just quoting a song ****during an improvisation or solo, but if you play a full statement of a melody that we all can recognize, then we’re going to assume that you’re going to that song in the middle of where we are in a song.

So, during the sound check, our piano player Tyler had quoted a full melody, and Kenoa, not knowing what the rules were, went into the song, but it wasn’t clearly done by Tyler. So we just stopped for a second and clarified, “If you do that, that means we’re going to go there, because that’s how we’re all listening”

So sometimes I’ll say something just for the sake of clarity.

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“We never make set lists. I never make a setlist”

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THE LAST TIME WE TALKED, YOU WERE JUST ABOUT TO GET MARRIED. NOW THAT YOU’RE MARRIED, IN RETROPSECT WHAT WAS THE BEST PRE-MARITAL ADVICE THAT SOMEONE GAVE YOU?

That’s a great question! (laughs)

My dad, who is a marriage counselor, didn’t do an “official” meeting with us, but we stopped in Chicago ***right before we got married. The thing that I came away with that I still hold on to is that he said that I have to protect my spouse from my own selfishness.

THAT’S A GOOD ONE

I think that is in line with my musical direction; put the other person ahead of yourself

**In all facets of life I try to do my best to help my wife, and what she may need over what I may need. In some ways it’s easier and other ways it’s much harder. Focusing on that has strengthened our marriage

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“Just playing one thing while still playing the previous piece and try to phase them together, so that getting from one thing to the next becomes a journey

We do that pretty heavily and pretty often”

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WHAT HAVE YOU LEARNED ABOUT YOURSELF SINCE BEING MARRIED?

(chuckles) How stubborn I can be!

I’ve learned about my own stubbornness. As giving as I’ve always thought that I am, I’m now learning what real sacrifice looks like, what real responsibility is, and being held accountable to my wife. My wife knows me and  sees me. It’s beautiful, and I love that, and I need that, but she has definitely taught me about myself! (laughs)

WHAT WOULD YOU SAY ABOUT THE LINE “YOU DON’T MARRY A WOMAN, YOU MARRY A FAMILY”?

Oh, yeah.

But I think that I knew that from the beginning, so once we started dating and got serious, I already went to meet her parents, her brothers and everything. Met a lot of the family.

That was also something that let me know that this was my person, because I so naturally fell in love with her family as well as her. They’re loving and supportive

Right now, she’s on tour, but they’re like “C’mon over to our house; make sure you come by. We’ll take care of you”. That means a lot.

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“In all facets of life I try to do my best to help my wife, and what she may need over what I may need. In some ways it’s easier and other ways it’s much harder. Focusing on that has strengthened our marriage”

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BECAUSE YOU TOUR A LOT, HOW DO YOU FIND A LOCAL CHURCH OR KEEP ACCOUNTABLE TO SOMEONE? LIFE ON THE ROAD CAN TOUGH.

It is.

When we’re at home here in Brooklyn, we usually go to Brooklyn Tabernacle. But, if we’re on the road, I try at the very least to Live Stream my home church in Chicago. There are also a couple of other pastors that I like to listen to: Philip Anthony Mitchell from Atlanta, Smoky Norful has a church in Bowling Brook that he Livestreams.

WHEN YOU GO TO A CHURCH AND THERE”S WORSHIP MUSIC, IS IT HARD SUBJECTIVE TO THE MUSIC, OR DO YOU CATCH YOURSELF ANALYZING IT AT TIMES?

(chuckles) It’s not hard to be subjective.

I cannot turn off the analyzing when I hear the music. I just cannot not do it, but it doesn’t get in the way. I think that as I’ve gotten older, it gets a bit easier. It doesn’t get in the way of focusing on worship and the reason that we’re there, which is worshipping God.

I think about that, because when I was in church and playing. Once my brother and I started really getting into jazz and playing all of that stuff, with the freedom of improvisation. We’d start to play these little licks here and there, and then get a little more soloistic. My dad just reminded us “this isn’t a gig; this is worship, and you’re here for a reason, and you’re supporting something that is a bigger Reason than yourselves”. That helped me become the musician and man that I am.

 

DID YOU EVER HAVE A CRISIS OF FAITH?

I don’t think a “crisis of faith”; but I’ve had to learn to know who Jesus really is

HOW DID YOU DO THAT?

I had to empty myself. I had to come to terms with the fact that I’m not as righteous as I thought I was, and I had to start over; I started reading the Bible from the beginning

LAST TIME WE TALKED, THE STORY OF THE PRODIGAL SON WAS ON YOUR MIND. IS THERE ANY NEW THEME THAT PRESENTLY KEEPS COMING BACK TO  YOU AT THIS STAGE OF YOUR JOURNEY?

Proverbs 3:5-6 “Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding. In all your ways acknowledge Him and He will direct your path”

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*I don’t think (I’ve had) a “crisis of faith”; but I’ve had to learn to know who Jesus really is”

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IS THERE ANY WRITER OR THEOLOGIAN THAT KEEPS YOU GOING AND HITS  YOU WHERE YOU LIVE?

Dr. Tim Mackie. He’s a Bible nerd, and I’m a nerd

What he’s doing with The Bible Project, which is a non-profit that makes videos explaining various parts of the Bible. He is helping to show people how the Bible is not just this big collection of writings over thousands of years, but that it’s a unified story that points to Jesus

The way he does it, the details that he gets into, and the scholarship behind it appeals to me, while still being very relatable. 2037

A LOT OF YOUR MUSIC HAS A CHRISTIAN MESSAGE. IS THERE SUCH A THING AS “CHRISTIAN JAZZ” OR “CHRISTIAN MUSIC” IN YOUR OPINION?

Hmmm. I don’t know.

**I don’t want to say “No”, but what I think is that I am a follower of Christ, so I am a Christian. That is who I am, and what I do is play jazz.

I don’t know if that labels what I do as “Christian Jazz”, but who am I to say that that is not what it is? I’ve also learned and played what jazz is at its core history, this black American music that provides creative music.

It’s hard to say “this is one thing; it is not that thing”, so speaking for myself, I am who I am and then there is what I do

WHEN YOU COMPOSE, DO YOU HAVE BACK MOMENTS WHERE YOU THINK “JESUS HELP ME” AT THE BEGINNNING OF THE SCORE, AND A “TO THE GLORY OF GOD” AT THE END?

IN OTHER WORDS, DO YOU SEE YOUR MUSIC AS A MORE SPIRITUAL OR MUSICAL ENDEAVOR, OR BOTH?

Spiritual.

For the last few albums, I just did a heavy Bible study to understand. It’s all in line.  It wasn’t like “I’m going to start studying Scripture in order to make the album”; that’s just what I was studying in Scripture. And, as I live my life this is how I play it as a musician.

I have the chance to lead a band and perform, and this is how it’s coming out naturally and compositionally until this was where I felt that the Lord was leading me to put this out

WHAT ARE YOUR FUTURE GOALS BESIDES HAVING A FEW KIDS?

(chuckles) Trying to slow down!

The next few years, my wife and I are touring pretty heavily

But I’ve been teaching more the past few years here in New York at The Manhattan School of Music and The New School. I really want to be able to do more of that and be here for my students

I have other ideas for ensembles and working on ideas for my music. I’m never running out of ideas

WHAT GIVES YOU THE MOST JOY?

Making other people happy

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“It wasn’t like “I’m going to start studying Scripture in order to make the album”; that’s just what I was studying in Scripture. And, as I live my life this is how I play it as a musician”

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YOU HAVE PLAYED A LOT IN LA. DO YOU NOTICE A DIFFERENCE IN THE MUSIC SCENE BETWEEN NY AND LA?

Yes.

I don’t know how else to say it, but there is a slight edge or hostility in New  York that I think comes from an urgency. LA is understandably more laid back; it’s probably more about quality of life?

You’re really surviving in New York, whereas in LA I think because the weather and quality of life is so much better, you don’t feel like you have to wake up and dig your way into wherever you’re going

WHEN’S THE NEXT TIME YOU”RE HITTING SO CAL?

‘Around the fall or November

IF YOU HAVEN’T SEEN JOEL ROSS IN CONCERT, YOU’RE GOING TO BE IN FOR A TREAT TO SEE TRUE COMMUNICATION AND TEAMWORK. IF YOU HAVEN’T YET HEARD HIS ALBUMS, GET READY TO HEAR TRUE FAITH.

LOOK FOR HIM FOR HIS UPCOMING TERM AND DO YOUR SOUL A FAVOR.